US Coast Guard Licensed Captain, ABYC Certified Electrical Technician, Warrior Sailing Instructor, and Founder of Boat Doctor – Conor Smith truly is the expert of electronics meeting the ocean.  Dr. Conor Smith joins host Dr. Denis Phares at the 2024 Annapolis Sailboat Show to share his journey of growing up on a sailboat to becoming a marine power expert. He discusses the importance of lithium battery retrofits, the unique electrical challenges faced on boats, and his mission to make safe, reliable power accessible for all boaters. Tune in to learn about his work with ABYC standards, the latest in off-grid marine systems, and his efforts to support veterans through sailing.

Conor Smith is Transforming Marine Electrical Systems with Lithium-Ion Technology

Raised on a sailboat, Conor Smith’s family lived off-grid while navigating waters from the Great Lakes to the Caribbean. Powered by DIY electrical systems, Connor developed skills in off-grid energy management at an early age while maintaining and learning from his boat’s battery-powered systems. These early experiences shaped his passion for off-grid marine power solutions that sparked his eventual pursuit of a Ph.D. in Marine Physics at the University of Miami, where he studied ocean dynamics and the behavior of waves and currents. After completing his doctorate, Conor continued to explore the world of marine science and electrical systems, working on geophysical projects and seafloor mapping. His return to marine electrical systems eventually led him to found Boat Doctor about a year and a half ago. This company focuses on safely and effectively installing lithium-ion battery systems in boats, helping clients convert aging battery systems to modern lithium power to meet today’s increased energy needs.

In this episode of The Li-MITLESS ENERGY Podcast, Conor and host Dr. Denis Phares dive into the specifics of lithium-ion battery technology and its importance for modern boats. They discuss the value of American Boat and Yacht Council (ABYC) standards for lithium battery installations, highlighting the need for safety regulations to keep pace with evolving technology. Conor details how lithium batteries are game changers for marine power in terms of power storage and reliability. Meeting rigorous safety standards, Battle Born Batteries are designed to handle marine demands, including the durability to handle extreme environments and the capacity to support navigation, communication, and essential systems. Finally, Conor shares how his knowledge of sailboats and marine electrical systems has allowed him to give back by volunteer work with Warrior Sailing, a nonprofit supporting veterans through comprehensive sailing programs.

Catch the full episode on YouTube, your favorite podcast platform, to hear more from Conor. Follow along as he shares insights into marine electrical systems through Boat Doctor and highlights inspiring veteran sailing programs with Warrior Sailing on Facebook and Instagram.

Podcast Transcript

Denis Phares  0:11

Welcome to The Li-MITLESS ENERGY Podcast. We are here in Annapolis, Maryland for the Annapolis Boat Show. It is my pleasure to welcome to the podcast, Conor Smith, the founder of Boat Doctor, welcome.

Conor Smith  0:22

Yes. Thank you so much.

Denis Phares  0:24

It’s great to meet you.

Conor Smith  0:25

Yeah, same here.

Denis Phares  0:26

So Conor, Boat Doctor specializes specifically in lithium-ion battery retrofits on boats.

Conor Smith  0:33

Yes.

Denis Phares  0:34

How’d you get into that?

Conor Smith  0:35

So, I have to say it was, I was born and raised on a sailboat. Technically, we did have a home. It was based in Chicago, but I was a August baby in Chicago, and my parents weren’t going to miss the rest of the season just because I was born. So, I was first inside my parent’s sailboat when I was three weeks old, and I guess I’ve kind of never left the boat. And I was later homeschooled aboard the sailboat. My brother and my parents, we traveled up through Canada, down the east coast in the Caribbean, and we lived off grid, off the battery system that we designed and engineered for that boat. And back then, it was wind generators, and, of course, lead acid batteries.

Denis Phares  1:15

How much lead acid battery? Do you remember?

Conor Smith  1:17

We had six of the golf cart batteries so that is 660 amp hours, of which half of that’s usable. We had a wind generator, which made about 75 amp hours a day, and then we had alternator on the engine. And we were always out of power, and we were trying to do homeschooling. The only saving grace was that homeschooling for us was mostly paper and pencil, now it’s mostly computer-based. So, the energy needs were a lot lower then, but it was really instrumental for me to be, at such an influential age, at 10 and 11, being in the Fort Lauderdale Boat Show, going around to all the booths and vendors, just like Annapolis here. Looking at power systems with my dad, trying to make decisions we were going to use for the boat. And then, I lived with that system, trying to be homeschooled and all that for that time.

Denis Phares  2:12

Is your dad an engineer?

Conor Smith  2:14

No, he’s a new home builder, but he was really hands-on, really mechanically inclined. So, I grew up with him working on boats. I was in the engine room with him changing oil, and working on the engine, and topping off the batteries with distilled water, and the whole setup. So, just really flare, and kind of stuck with it. And so, I just have a fascination for off-grid systems, and especially when an off-grid system gets you somewhere you can’t normally have power. If you go and you’re in some remote place and you are living comfortably with the system that you designed and use and is functioning in a good way, it’s awesome. It’s a great feeling.

Denis Phares  2:54

And then you went and did a Ph.D., you’re Dr. Conor Smith.

Conor Smith  2:59

Yeah. Technically. Dr. Smith, yeah, but call me by my first name. Doctor. (Laughs)

Denis Phares  3:02

Okay. Doctor. I was going to say Dr. Conor Smith.

Conor Smith  3:06

No. In the sciences, it’s really casual, nobody really refers to that except in an academic setting. Yeah, just being on the water, growing up, checking the weather, the winds, your whole safety and comfort relies on the wind and the waves. The knowledge of that is really kind of critical. So, stuck with it. Studied physics and meteorology in undergrad, and then went on to get a Ph.D. in the University of Miami in marine physics, which is basically small-scale oceanography. So, I studied how waves and currents interact and tried to better measure them from a radar that was mounted on a spacecraft.

Denis Phares  3:49

A lot of fluid mechanics there.

Conor Smith  3:51

A lot of fluid mechanics, yeah. Navier-Stokes, a lot of different variables and equations. It was an amazing experience. The biggest thing that I miss from that whole experience is other people, because when you find yourself in grad school, you don’t accidentally… I shouldn’t say, find yourself in grad school. When you go through the effort to apply through the whole application process, it weeds out everybody that’s not interested in being there. So, the community is like a hard-working, interested community, and there is… So, the Rosenstiel School, a part of the University of Miami, the marine science campus had marine biology, marine physics, geochemistry, meteorology. I’m probably missing something else. But everybody could universally go to and say, “Hey, how did you get into this?” And everybody had an answer, which was like, “Oh, I was on a beach and I saw this whale that got stranded,” or, “Oh my gosh, I got caught in this hurricane,” or tornado or weather phenomenon. Everybody has stories, so my story was growing up on the boat, and everybody had their own unique story. So, it was a cool environment with that interested, hard working group.

Denis Phares  5:04

That’s great. So, did you start Boat Doctor right after your Ph.D., Or how long did that take?

Conor Smith  5:09

No, I went a few years. I took off on a boat myself. I finished the degree. And during grad school, I was living aboard a sailboat and kind of slowly fixing up during that time. And then, my treat to myself was a little hiatus on the boat with my partner, and we sailed down to Panama and back on that boat. And then sold the boat, moved to Florida, and I worked for a company doing some geophysical work in seafloor mapping. And then missed the marine electrical world, and founded Boat Doctor, so to help people…

Denis Phares  5:44

When was that?

Conor Smith  5:45

So, that was about a year and a half ago, and just kind of applying everything that I learned from living aboard the boats for 20-plus years with some of the… It’s so hard, there’s so much new technology, you really have to be totally in it to do the conversion safely and correctly. So, I just saw the need to help people transition their boats because a lot of these boats now are getting 20, 30, 40, years old. The boats are safe, the electrical systems are really aging, and they’re trying to upgrade with lithium-ion phosphate batteries, but they’re not safely doing it. I kind of saw that need to kind of focus on that, provide that expertise to help people convert their boats and get more power out of their systems.

Denis Phares  6:29

And you’re ABYC certified?

Conor Smith  6:32

Yeah. I just finished my third certification, so now I guess I’m the master technician. So, it’s been a fun ride.

Denis Phares  6:41

So, let’s talk about ABYC and lithium because I’ve been involved in that endeavor to figure out how to create metrics that form a compliance system. How good a job do you feel ABYC is doing in terms of getting that information sorted out and getting it out there, and do you have any issues with it?

Conor Smith  7:07

Hmm. Obviously, the role they are… There’s a needed role. The implementation of good strategies and suggestions and metrics to install systems, that is needed. I think everybody’s learning about how to implement this new lithium technology safely, I guess, not to be put on the spot, but I wonder if some of this information is behind a paywall, and I think that is a little bit of a challenge to getting the information to the people who need it most. And I think that’s partially why I was kind of motivated to start a company that focused on this because that information needs to get out there. And this podcast is great. You guys are doing a great job getting that information out there. But that would be my only thing, that I wish ABYC was a little more able to disseminate the information more rapidly and more available. But I think they’re doing a good job developing the E13 standards, trying to get people to doing it safely. And I think, overall, they’re doing the best job they can.

Denis Phares  8:22

Yeah, I agree. It certainly is a collaboration. There’s a lot of folks at the table, a lot of people involved. We’re obviously a lithium-ion battery manufacturer, so there are issues that we see, and there are issues that we don’t. Not being specifically on boats. And so, is there something unique other than… There’s obviously safety aspects, but is there something unique to being on the water, from an electrical standpoint, that you think is relevant for lithium-ion battery manufacturers to address?

Conor Smith  8:59

Oh, you mean compared to RV systems, off-grid systems?

Denis Phares  9:07

Mm-hmm. Yes. We’ve done a lot of those too.

Conor Smith  9:09

Yeah, absolutely. I think the biggest thing is, in a marine environment, the importance of reliability takes precedence over everything else. In my opinion, absolutely the most important thing. And I think it may not be the most important topic for other applications. The loss of power, in certain instances on a boat, you could lose your life. Not to be dramatic, but that’s certainly possible. If you’re navigating an inlet in the middle of the night, and your radar and all of your navigation systems running on your batteries, loss of power in that moment, you could absolutely lose the boat, and then who knows how it’s going to affect you? So, that is just so, so critical to have absolute reliability, and that’s why I’m really excited for these new batteries that are coming out that are able to communicate externally, to give you notice, give you alarms and notifications. So, if you are ever in these instances where the batteries have… If the charging systems have problems that are causing the batteries to go out of their safe working parameters, that you have notification to adjust whatever is going on to keep giving you power.

Denis Phares  10:29

Yeah. That’s absolutely right, and that was one of the most important comments that came up in the in early discussions in the development of E13, was that there needs to be warnings because, you’re right, in your RV, you lose power, all right, it’s annoying, you gotta pull over, or you’re at least not in danger. But yeah. So, you need warnings. You have to know what’s going on inside the battery. And, as an electrician, as an installer of these systems, you kind of know what to look for. What do you tell your customers? Because they might even… Even if there are warnings, do they understand what they’re looking for if there’s a low voltage alarm or if there’s a potential high current alarm?

Conor Smith  11:15

Yeah. So much of the work is so customized. Not only installation, but the training with each client because you have to understand what their knowledge level is, and then you have to design a system that works not only to their boat and to their budget, but to their knowledge level. So, we might install extra safety precautions if that boat owner is a more novice user.

Denis Phares  11:43

Some redundancy in the power.

Conor Smith  11:45

Yes, absolutely.

Denis Phares  11:46

In which case, it’s not a matter of life and death anymore if they’re… Would you say, in most cases, that the lithium battery bank that you’re installing is powering critical systems that could make it a matter of life and death?

Conor Smith  11:58

Yeah, it depends. I’ve done it both ways where the entire house bank is replaced with lithium-ion phosphate. And I’ve also done kind of parallel systems where you have a critical loads battery that’s being trickle charged from the house bank, which is kind of my preferred way, just to… If everything goes wrong, you’ll have a really natural warning because the cabin lights will go out, the fridge will go out, the stereo will stop working, but the boat’s going be sailing on the straight course. The running lights will be on, the GPS will be on. You don’t even need to have an alarm, just the boat is going to be operating differently.

Denis Phares  12:42

Just a dumb lead acid battery there?

Conor Smith  12:43

Yeah, just a dumb lead acid battery, but at least it gives you a step between. It’s like, instead of having an alarm to tell you something’s going on, it’s just a completely redundant step that the boat will be behaving differently. That’s unmistakable. Because an alarm goes off, you might go out, “Okay, what’s going on? Why is there an alarm?” But the lights go off, the non-critical light, then you go, “Oh, okay, something’s going on,” and then you have time to rectify the situation. And it’s a completely stressless environment.

Denis Phares  13:20

Right. Redundancy obviously makes a ton of sense, especially in those conditions. But if you’ve got a separate battery, why would that battery be a lead acid battery, not another lithium battery? If they’re less… I would consider lead acid batteries less reliable, especially if you’re trickle charging them all the time, you’re not using them, and then you never know when it’s time to use them if they’re going to be good or not.

Conor Smith  13:44

That’s true. Yeah, I guess, in the environment where… In my experience, what kills the lead acid battery is the deep cycles. I personally killed a lead acid house bank in like six months. I think I’m relatively experienced with this stuff, and I’ve personally absolutely just destroyed a battery. I couldn’t believe it, I was like, “How am I getting low-voltage alarms?”

Denis Phares  14:13

You knew you were over-draining them, did you? You thought they would last longer.

Conor Smith  14:16

I thought they would last longer. So, in my experience, when they’re trickle-charged in a quality AGM battery, they tend to be quite reliable. But it’s true, if you are not regularly using it to know if it’s actually working, that’s true. Maybe that would be a good way to test the extra batteries actually available for you when that charging source stops. But it could be another lithium battery. I guess the few… At times, starting the engine, a lead acid battery seems to work really well in that environment. It’s simple, starts the engine, big rush. It gets topped off quick. It seems to work well, and so I’ve always kind of kept it simple, just using that as an interim step. But you could do it other ways.

Denis Phares  15:10

Well, in terms of crank the engine, you’re preaching the choir here because the thing about a lead acid battery or a lithium battery is that you never want to have a user have access to that power without some sort of protection in between. And that protection typically is, I think the safest protection is some sort of FET-based BMS. In which case, cranking is really bad. That surge through a FET is not good. And so, usually what we do is we have multiple chemistries, and you’ve got the cranking battery driven by lead acid, but then you’ve got the critical loads and maybe some redundancy with lithium. So, that’s actually the way we like to do it. So, the reason I brought up the backup battery as a lithium or lead acid, it used to be convention to charge a lead acid bank from an alternator without anything else but a small lead acid battery just to provide that capacitance to eliminate that fly back spike in the case that you get a BMS cut off. And what they were finding was that the battery kept going bad. The sacrificial battery kept going bad. So, now we have the onset of more sophisticated alternator control, like the Wake speed or DC-DC converters. What has been the biggest pitfall for you in terms of alternator charging of a lithium bank?

Conor Smith  16:36

It is heat management of the alternator. The lead acid batteries have such a high internal resistance, they quickly start pushing back and stop. The charging acceptance rate just falls down to tiny amounts. So, when you’re charging an alternator, it’s a perfect break for the alternator to start cooling down and stop working so hard, even on a huge battery bank. It’s shocking how quick the ramp-down happens. And obviously, lithium-ion phosphate, they take it almost all the way to the very end.

Denis Phares  17:12

Till it’s fully charged.

Conor Smith  17:13

And that’s amazing, but the alternator hates it. It works really hard now, so that’s the thing. So,  knowing that every installation includes provisions to keep the alternator cool. Blowers that come on on a relay. Not on a switch you throw on, when you turn the ignition on, they automatically come on. And that’s something that I do automatically in any installation. So, blowers come on, pull cool air out of the lower part of the bilge, blow right across the face of the alternator, and then another one pulling the heat out of the engine room to keep that as cool as possible. Obviously, the Wake speed has a alternator temperature sensor, which has to get put on and keep the alternator cool and working effectively. So, yeah, I do that. I try to upgrade the wiring to it, so that way that’s not causing any extra heat to the system. So, just really trying to mitigate the heat to keep that alternator working. And then, I always try to derate it, get a bigger alternator than needed. Derate it by 20 or 30% so it’s just working as cool and easy as possible to get it working as long as possible because I hate calls from past clients. I love hearing from them, I worry about a system breaking or not working, so I really want… Reliability is really, really paramount.

Denis Phares  18:35

You get a lot of those calls?

Conor Smith  18:36

So far, they’ve all been basically social calls. And a lot of the clients are here at the boat show, and are calling me. Great social calls.

Denis Phares  18:44

But each time the phone rings and it’s one of them, your heart rate goes up.

Conor Smith  18:48

I’m like, “Oh, I hope everything’s okay.” I pick up, “Hey, I’m just checking in. I want this next thing now.” “Okay, great.” All right, what a great conversation. But I always try to make sure there’s none of those calls.

Denis Phares  18:59

So, how many of you are there out there in terms of really specialized lithium installers that are not ABYC certified?

Conor Smith  19:08

Not many. There’s not many, that’s for sure. I’m in Northeast Florida. There’s only a small handful that operate in the whole kind of the nook there, from Georgia down to Cocoa Beach, I’m kind of really the only one that specializes in it, but to be fair, I’ve gone all over. I have clients now in Michigan that I regularly fly up for. I’m putting a big generator replacement battery bank in a beautiful… What’s that? A trawler, a motor yacht. So, I go all over for it now. Now once the word gets out, and yeah, find the right clients that you kind of travel for wherever they are.

Denis Phares  19:56

Mm-hmm. Well, we need more of you. There’s a lot of lithium out there in marine, what do you think the penetration is right now with lithium?

Conor Smith  20:03

I think those that are living aboard their boat actively using it, it is certainly the majority now are switching to lithium. 60, 70% of people who are actively cruising their boat have switched to lithium-ion phosphate, or switching, or thinking about it, in their process of it. I think the usage profile, if you’re still a weekender, I don’t know if the numbers work, it just doesn’t make sense. If you need a small amount of power and frequently, the time it takes, the cost, it’s just not really a priority for those, that usage profile. But certainly those that are actively using the boat and going out and traveling, it’s almost a must now. It’s a life changer.

Denis Phares  20:46

Well, before we wrap up here, can you tell me a little bit about your other activity in terms of bringing veterans sailing and training them?

Conor Smith  20:54

Yeah. So, about two and a half, three years ago, I started volunteering with Warrior Sailing. It’s a nonprofit that helps ill and injured veterans. And we use the medium of sailing to help heal injuries. So, a lot of non-visual injuries and illnesses like PTSD and depression. And the camaraderie and mission-focused activity of sailing is a great way to bring people together. And my role in the program is to teach the electrical side, electrical systems of boating. They have learned to sail, they’ve come through our program, they’re going on deliveries, they’re going on friend’s boats, they’re buying their own boats. They don’t know what’s, quote-unquote, under the hood of the boat they are on, or sailing on, or they’re with. And we had a couple of stories of people that went out with a friend, they thought it was a good new boat, shouldn’t be a problem. And, all of a sudden, all the lights went out, and they had no idea how to help, how to fix, how to be of assistance. So, we started a curriculum. It’s a marine systems training with a focus on electrical and I call it ‘The basics of a multimeter.’ “This is a multimeter, here’s the top 10 things you should check on a boat. Before you leave the dock, find the batteries, check the voltage, start the engine. You don’t even have to know the exact voltages, just look for the voltage to go up. If you know that, okay, at least there’s some basic charging that’s happening. Unplug from the dock, start the generator. Flip on a charger, does the voltage go up again?” Just these basic checks of how…”And here’s an alternator. Here’s the top couple of things to look for,” and kind of these basic systems. So, help keep our graduates safe around the water either on friend’s boats or their own boats, and stuff.

Denis Phares  22:52

That’s awesome. That’s great. Well, thank you so much for the work that you do for the veterans, and really appreciate the work that you’re doing for the industry as well.

Conor Smith  23:02

Yeah. It’s a pleasure. It’s a lot of fun. It’s a fun ride.

Denis Phares  23:03

Thanks for coming on the podcast.

Conor Smith  23:05

Yeah, thank you. Thank you so much.

Denis Phares  23:10

Thanks for joining us on The Li-MITLESS ENERGY Podcast. Be sure to subscribe on any of your favorite podcast platforms.

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